CR 028: Jermaine Crawford is Ready for His Next Act
The former child star discusses his portrayal of Dukie Weems in “The Wire,” his work with homeless youth, and what he’s looking forward to in his career.
Jermaine Crawford was just 12 years old when he booked the role of Duquan “Dukie” Weems in The Wire. Created by former journalist David Simon, The Wire’s brutally honest and brilliantly written depiction of crime and law enforcement in Baltimore consistently landed the series atop many critics’ “must watch” lists. But it was the show’s fourth season, which explored the ineptitude of the public school system, that was the most emotionally devastating.
In season four we meet the “young‘uns”—Namond, Duquan, Michael, and Randy—whose days are a chaotic jumble of middle school, neglect, and violence. The youngest of the four, Duquan—referred to as “Dukie” due to his lack of personal hygiene—lives with his drug addicted parents in an apartment with no running water. Despite the efforts of a few caring teachers, by the end of season five, Dukie is homeless, a dropout, and an addict.
Crawford says that although he is enormously grateful that he got to play the role, he wasn’t emotionally mature enough at the time to separate from the character at the end of the day. “It was hard to let him go,” he says. “I didn’t realize the effect of how hard it was until years afterward. We wrapped when I was 15, but I didn’t really see, ‘Oh, wow. This is still attached to me’ until I was about 18. You know, you play something for so long, people treat you a certain way. Those words that they’re telling you on set, it starts to get into your natural psyche. So it was tough. I understand, as an adult, where to divide the line and what I need to do to make sure that doesn’t happen again. But when you’re 12, reality and imagination is hard to decipher. I’m very grateful for the role, the opportunity, but it was definitely a doozy shedding the Duquan character. It was tough.”
Over a recent early morning Zoom call, Crawford and I discussed his work on The Wire, future projects, and the work he’s done to raise money for homeless youth.
SANDRA EBEJER: In looking over your IMDb page, it appears as though The Wire was your first role. When did you begin acting?
JERMAINE CRAWFORD: One of the very first professional productions I’ve ever done was a Stephen Schwartz play at Ford’s Theatre in Washington, D.C. called Children of Eden. I was eight years old. And I was an understudy at Shakespeare Theatre in D.C. when I was about seven. So I started my career pretty young. By the time The Wire audition came, I had already been doing a lot of theater.
Duquan was a pretty heavy role to get as a 12-year-old and there are some truly heartbreaking scenes that you appeared in. Did you and the other kids in the show fully understand the emotional intent underlying these moments? Or were you just acting out the role?
Acting out the role. I think we understood the make believe of it all, and committing to whatever was on the page in front of you. We got that. But I don’t think I really understood, until I was 21, “This was so much more nuanced. There were so many layers. Oh, this is what they were trying to say. Oh, that’s what this really was. Okay, so this is how a Bubbles becomes a Bubbles, how Omar becomes Omar.”
I don’t think we really got it. We had Robert Chew, who was Proposition Joe, helping us prepare for each episode. He was our acting coach. We would get the script and would rehearse with him. For us, it was just about the fundamentals of craft, as opposed to (a) being fans of the show and (b) really knowing what the hell was going on. We were just putting ourselves in the scenario on the pages. It was very pure. If anything, I’m trying to get back to that level of purity of just seeing what’s on the page and putting myself into it. But we had no idea really what was going on. Or at least I didn’t. I was the youngest.
Were there any adult actors on the show that you were particularly close with?
Sonja [Sohn], who played Kima. She took us under her wing very early on. Because I will say, when we first got hired, a lot of the adult actors were a little confused [as to] why these four kids were coming in and being the focal point after having a year off air. It was gentle camaraderie. I wouldn’t even call it a competition. But that first episode, they’re like, “Who the hell are these kids? What are y’all doing here?”
Michael K. Williams [who played Omar] and myself were pretty close during that time. I think there were a lot of things that he saw in the character that paralleled to himself, or maybe he saw in myself that paralleled him. He did take me under his wing, and we were close, especially during the time of filming. Andre Royo [who played Bubbles] was someone who also kept in touch. At first, I’m like, “Why does he care so much?” But I get it now, what that kind of role can do to you, especially seeing me as a child.
To be honest, by the middle of the fourth season, [it was] such a family on that set. I haven’t worked on many other sets that are like this. Everybody was family. Everybody had love towards each other and a real deep, genuine connection. Some were closer than others, but if we ever saw any of the other actors in passing, they would give us time. I remember bumping into Michael B. Jordan around the fifth season, and he was like, “Hey. How y’all doing?” He wasn’t on the show anymore, but just being on the show keeps us all connected in this really special way. It’s like we were part of something that was quite monumental, and it’s like a fraternity that you didn’t have to get hazed into. But yeah, Michael, Sonja, Andre, those are the ones that come to mind.
What was it like for you when the show ended?
It was a bit of a whirlwind. I had never experienced being on a series before, let alone a series ending. I won’t lie—I was happy I no longer had to play Dukie. That I remember. Because it was just so much. It was really tough getting to that place and being that person. I was walking into 16. I wanted to be cool. I didn’t want to be that guy anymore. So I was very happy about that, but I did understand that, damn, this is ending.
I was grateful enough in my career to book a few pilots and work on some great independent films with really cool filmmakers. I was able to keep working and keep going. But adolescence had its way. And I think people expected me to be Dukie. The show is so real, you almost expect the character to walk in the room. And I had had this huge growth spurt. I think everybody could tell by the fifth season, I was not Dukie in real life. That is not who I was. It’s not what you were getting in the audition room. So I’m grateful for the people who took the chance on me to do something fresh in the roles that I played. But it was tough, because it’s like I was shedding the skin of the Duquan character before the eyes of the world.
That thing that I wanted to happen for me in my career didn’t happen as quick as I thought it would. That was the toughest part, because there’s a lot of people from that show who shot off into super stardom immediately, from Idris Elba to Michael B. Jordan, Michael K. Williams, you name it. And I was like, “Hmmm, when’s my go at it?” But now that I know what I know now, it was all divine, because that time off screen allowed me to build my craft as a writer. Not being so active as an actor gave me the opportunity to fall in love just as deeply with another art form.
Many years later, you returned to the David Simon universe to portray a cop in We Own This City. What was it like to reconnect with so many of your former colleagues?
It was like a time capsule that I jumped into. It felt like not a day had passed. We were shooting in Baltimore, I’m looking at David and Nina [Noble, producer] and Jamie Hector [Marlo in The Wire]. The same hair and makeup team. The same wardrobe team. It was just like, “Whoa. This is weird.” It’s like 20 years had passed and not a day. The only thing that let me know that I wasn’t in this weird, magical time warp was that I knew that we had lost some people since the filming of the show.
How I like to see it is that it was a chapter closing in my life and a new chapter opening because the world got to see me for who I am today. It was a reintroduction. It’s like, “Oh! That’s Dukie? Okay! Look at him. He’s a little older. He’s a little mature now. He’s clean for God’s sakes.” It was really cool to have that reintroduction on such a major scale. It was like a fresh start because the Dukie thing was a lot for me. This was my second chance to really get out there and show what I can do in something that wasn’t going to take the life out of me.
You recently shared that you’re creating a new show, Has Been, inspired by your life experience. What can you share about it?
I sold a show to HBO Max a year or two ago, but after the strike and all the different changes with Warner and Warner Bros. Discovery, HBO passed on the show. We were in development for a year and a half. I learned so much about writing for television in that HBO incubator. Essentially, I took all the knowledge I learned from that experience and applied it to my own story.
Has Been is an underdog story. It is the backdrop of Hollywood, but people can identify with it more than not, where you feel like you are qualified for something, but the industry that you’re trying to break into is resisting you at every angle. I think everyone has felt marginalized, everyone has felt left out and has felt deserving of an opportunity that a tough industry won’t give them. And that’s what the story is about. We’re still in the early phases, but I did want to announce to the world that I’m doing this to see who might want to be involved. It’s gone well. A lot of people have reached out to me, wanting to produce, wanting to write. So top of the year, I’ll jump full force into it. I’m very excited, because I think I’m a part of this new wave of filmmakers that doesn’t have to wait for HBO to make a story. We can do these things independently and put it out ourselves. I have a lot of expertise in the business, a lot of relationships, so I’m really excited to see how this goes.
You stated that you’re creating your own series because “if Hollywood won’t tell our stories, we have to tell them ourselves.” What is your advice to actors who are struggling to get their foot in the door or break past the Hollywood gatekeepers?
Denzel Washington said, “Work on the stage.” It’s always been more inviting for artists, especially because a lot of plays have such huge ensembles. There’s something for somebody. There’s so many plays, there’s so many productions.
I would also say to live a life, because those experiences are going to be what you pull from when that role comes. When you commit to being an actor, it’s such a divine thing. You may think that you’re experiencing this breakup just for the hell of it or experiencing that loss just for the hell of it, but we’re naturally storytellers. We are the mirrors of the world. So my best advice would be just to live a life. Enjoy your life. Don’t let acting be your entire life. When it’s supposed to happen, it will happen. Life has a way of knocking on your door when it knows that you’re ready for it. You can knock all you want, but if you’re not ready, it’s not going to open. So just live your life. Go out with your friends. Smell the air, feel the sun on your skin, and hold on to what that feels like, because when those things show up on the page, you’ll know exactly how to execute it.
People can smell desperation from a mile away, and it doesn’t always translate in the best way. So it’s okay to want something, but don’t let it be your everything. Be confident in knowing that whether you get the role or you don’t get the role, you’ll be fine. The role that’s for you will find you.
Who are some of the artists who’ve inspired you? Is there anyone you look at and think, “I would really love to have a career like that”?
My Trinity is Denzel Washington, Will Smith, and Chadwick Boseman.
Why those three?
Denzel because he is a verb, he is an adjective, he is a noun. He is all encompassing. He’s got such range and such command and power in front of the camera. For Will Smith, I like how he was able to merge comedy with drama and action. He’s the triple threat. He can do it all. And for Chadwick Boseman, there was just such a regality that he had. It was like you were watching royalty. He was always confident. He was always so in touch and in tune with himself. He was so endearing. I think that’s something that’s similar that we have as actors. There’s something that was very soft and gentle in his eyes, that you really believed him, and you wanted to know him and connect to him. We shared the same acting coach, so I feel connected to him on such a deeper level. Black Panther was a breakthrough for all Black actors. Who wouldn’t want to do something like that in their career? That was just such an amazing moment and an amazing performance. He played James Brown. He played Jackie Robinson. The biopic work, that’s where you really see someone’s chops, and there was never a moment I’ve seen him on camera where I was like, “Eh.” He nailed it every single time. So those are my three: Will, Denzel, and Chadwick. Just merge them all and squeeze out the orange juice and hopefully that’s me in the cup. [Laughs]
You’ve done a lot of work with Safe Place for Youth. How did you come to be involved with them?
I created a campaign when I was 16, after I wrapped The Wire, called Code Blue Campaign. Code Blue Campaign advocates for homeless youth in the United States. Dukie stuck with me so strongly because as I was shedding the skin of the character, I was able to still keep the thoughts of the character. With that, I was able to turn it off. I was able to check out, go home, shower, and be in my parents’ embrace and be provided for and taken care of. There are many kids who do not have that luxury.
I remember once we were filming a classroom scene and Ed Burns, one of the writers, pulled me to the side. He was like, “You know, there’s a few real-life Dukies in here.” It stuck with me. Like, “What? There are people who are really going through this in real life, and I’m just acting, and I know how it makes me feel?” So youth work and spreading awareness and raising funds for homeless youth in the United States has become my life’s work—bigger than acting, bigger than storytelling, bigger than writing. I believe the impact that you leave on people is greater than the performance. Yes, I’m an actor. It’s what I love to do. But to be able to change the world, even if it’s one child at a time, that’s really cool to me.
And Safe Place for Youth—I live in Los Angeles. They’re one of the top organizations that deal with homeless youth out here. I’ve been able to partner with them on quite a few occasions, and we raised almost $350,000 for homeless youth in Los Angeles. There’s nothing that brings me greater joy. I love performance, but that character, Dukie, really did a number on me. It exposed me to so much. So, yeah, the youth work is really where my heart lies.
You’ve been posting a lot of comedy on social media. At this stage of your career, are you more attracted to comedy or drama?
Both. And that is really what Has Been is about. It’s a comedy with heart. One of my favorite filmmakers is Judd Apatow, and his ability to have you crying from laughing and then in a split second, you’re like, “Oh, wow. This is deep. This is almost sad. Whoa.” Because the human experience is just as funny as it is sad. I was just talking about the genius of Jim Carrey and Robin Williams, how they are so funny, but they’re equally phenomenal dramatic actors. Because if you’ve really gone through enough in your life and you really know how to tap in, you can do both. So yes, I’m drawn to comedy, because anyone who knows me off camera knows that I’m very animated. But I’ve experienced a lot of hardships in my life, so I want to be able to do both. That’s where that respect and admiration for Will Smith comes in, where you can be the Fresh Prince, but you can also do The Pursuit of Happyness. I would love that opportunity in my career to show both aspects of what I can do comedically and dramatically.
Is there anything you haven’t done yet in your work that you’d like to attempt?
Eventually, I would like to direct. I’ve had the opportunity to work with some of the best directors, and I think I have a story to tell. And there’s a certain way I know I could tell a story that no one else could, and I think that’s what a director is all about. I’ve worked with Greta Gerwig. We did a movie together called Damsels in Distress. It was with Whit Stillman, who is this phenomenal, esoteric director. Working with Greta—she wasn’t directing when we were doing it. It was many years ago. But she’s so unique as a person. She’s so unique as an actor. If she says she’s a director, it’s like, “I’m down, because your take on everything is so unique and so original that when it’s time for you to tell a story, I know it’s going to be very cool.” And I think we saw that with Barbie. Her perspective is just different. I think I’ve got that kind of quirk, that kind of spark, that kind of thing. I’ve worked with some really good people who have gone to do some great things, and eventually you start to say, “Well, there’s really no difference between me and them. I think I’d like a stab at it.” So, directing would be the thing and that was really inspired by Greta, seeing how she went from actress to director, and killed it.
If you could go back to your earliest days on The Wire and give yourself advice, what would you say?
Two things. One, it’s not real. Dukie is not real. Yes, it’s a reality for a lot of people, but it’s not real. The second thing I would say is, when they say “Cut,” cut. Snap out of it. Don’t take the character home with you. When they say cut and you’re wrapped for the day, you leave Dukie on the set.
To learn more about Jermaine Crawford, find him on Instagram.
This interview has been edited for clarity and length.
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