CR 026: John W. Lawson on ‘Daruma,’ Disability, and the Importance of Authentic Representation
The actor, advocate, and double amputee discusses how his latest role differs from those he’s played in the past.
Nearly 38 years ago, John W. Lawson’s life was upended when the then 30-year-old actor, singer, and pianist lost both hands in an accident. Despite having extensive training in the arts, Lawson says it was difficult as a double amputee to find work. “I remember being in the hospital in Chapel Hill,” he says. “I [spent] six months recovering, and I said, ‘I’m a trained actor, trained musician. There have to be plenty of jobs out there for actors with no hands.’ Little did I know that statement would lead me into a career of advocacy for people with disabilities, in front of and behind the camera, for over 35 years now.”
Though he’s amassed numerous film and television credits, Lawson’s role in the recently released indie film Daruma is the most significant. In the film, he plays Robert, a cantankerous war veteran who embarks on a road trip with his neighbor—an unemployed, day-drinking quadriplegic, Patrick (played by Tobias Forrest)—in order to transport Patrick’s 4-year-old daughter to the home of her maternal grandparents.
A heartwarming story about family and friendship, Daruma is notable in that, per the film’s press materials, it’s “the first film in U.S. cinematic history to star two authentically cast disabled leads in a narrative not about overcoming disability.” In fact, in a USC Annenberg study of the top 100 grossing films released in 2023, only 2.2% of speaking or named characters were depicted with a disability, and not all of those roles were performed by disabled actors—something Lawson points out is wildly inappropriate.
“If you compared it to, say, women—women represent 50% of the population. What if all the female roles were done by men? We would never stand for that. Or if you brought race into the situation, we would never stand for that. We don’t stand for blackface anymore, but we still allow crip-face.” He goes on to add, “Former First Lady Michelle Obama once said, ‘For so many people, television and movies may be the only way they understand people who aren’t like them.’ Daruma is historic because the film’s not about disability. That’s one thing I’m proud of, and I hope makes a difference in the way people view it.”
A labor of love shot on a shoestring budget, Daruma is now available to rent on numerous platforms, including Amazon and Apple TV+, though Lawson is quick to point out that audience reviews are critical to ensure it continues to find viewers. “Since we aren’t a big studio and this was self-produced, we need everyone that watches it to go to Amazon [and] write a review. We have to get 60 reviews before we affect the algorithm that then places us up front. Everyone that watches this film is a measurable metric that we can then go to the studios and go, ‘Across the country this film has been watched 100,000 times on no budget, but authentically cast, where your film of $30 million was only watched 90,000 times. Why is that?’ You can download it, rent it. But write a review. That’s what we need.”
Over a recent Zoom call, I chatted with Lawson about the importance of authentic representation, his biggest acting influence, and how Daruma’s Robert differs from his past roles.
SANDRA EBEJER: Congratulations on Daruma! How does it feel now that it’s out in the world?
JOHN W. LAWSON: It’s really good. Last night an acquaintance sent me a text and it just blew my mind. I’ll read it to you. “Absolutely incredible performance. The movie changed my perspective on a multitude of things. I loved every minute of it.” It was the coolest comment I’ve ever gotten. “It changed my perspective on multiple things.” He’s not disabled. He doesn’t have any type of visible disability. But that is my greatest hope for the film, that it touches everyone, whether they have a disability or not. I hope viewers see themselves represented in a way that reflects the reality of their experiences.
I feel like we often see disabled characters as either the villain or the cripple with a heart of gold. But in Daruma, the leads are complex, complicated characters. Is the role that you played different from ones you’ve seen in the past?
Oh, absolutely. The most common trope, as you were talking about, is the inspirational super crip. This is the person that has to overcome their disabilities in a heroic way. They become such an inspiration to everyone. That creates unrealistic expectations about what people with disabilities should achieve, and focuses more on their triumphs, rather than just everyday lives. Then, of course, the tragic victim who’s the person of pity. We have to feel sorry for them, and they can’t do anything on their own or lead a fulfilling life. The longest running one is the disabled villain that’s often seen in television and film, and that’s the pirate with the hook or an eye patch or missing a leg.
That was the thing about Daruma, that these were complex characters that were multifaceted. Yeah, they happen to have physical disabilities, but it was the emotional disabilities that we’re dealing with that made the movie. You could actually replace the two main characters with an able-bodied actor, and it would have been the exact same story. That’s what I liked about it.
How did you learn about the role? Did you audition for it?
They did a national search for auditions. My agent called me and said, “I saw this breakdown for a double hand amputee. The age range is a lot younger than you, but I’m going to submit you anyway.” And I go,” Heck yeah!” Over 30 years I’ve been doing this, I’ve never seen a breakdown specifically for a guy with no hands. So that’s how I found out about it. Tobias Forrest, who plays Patrick, lives about a mile from me and we read for each other and study scripts together when we have to tape. So I went over to his house—this was over seven years ago—and taped the audition with him. I said, “You should read for the guy in the wheelchair.” He goes, “No. It’s a paraplegic. I’m a quadriplegic. They’re gonna want me to do things I can’t do.” And I said, “You should still read for it.” He goes, “No, no, no.” And I said, “Let them say no.”
So we read the audition, we sent it in, and we ended up both getting a callback. We asked, “Could we do our callback together?” And they [said yes]. Toby and I have been friends for 10 or 12 years, and I think it was two separate scenes—one where we were at odds with each other, and then the second one, where we had been friends toward the end of the movie—and I think our real friendship came through naturally, and that’s why they cast us.
There’s a great moment in the film where the little girl, Camilla, asks you about your hands and Patrick tells her it’s rude to ask that. And you respond with, “How else is she going to learn?” Did Victoria Scott, the actress who played Camilla, have many questions for you going into this project? What was it like to work with such a young performer?
She had just turned six the week before we started shooting. The most emotionally mature child I’ve ever seen. All of the emotional shifts in her character—the one that gets me every time is when she goes, “But I love you...Daddy.” Instantly, everybody behind the camera started crying. And the director turned to her mom and said, “Did you tell her to say that?” She goes, “No, I don’t tell her how to act.” He went over [to Camilla] and goes, “Why did you take a break there?” And she goes, “Because it’s the first time I’ve ever called him Daddy.” It was just so phenomenal. She had no questions [about my hands]. We sat and talked to get to know each other some before we started filming. But no, [no questions] at all.
February 4th of next year will be 38 years that I’ve had my prosthetics, that I’ve been an amputee, and over those 38 years, I’ve learned that children have a natural curiosity. They go, “What’s that on the end of your arm?” Adults have a morbid curiosity. They say, “What happened to you? Relive the worst day of your life for my curiosity.” Kids just want to know why you have something different on the end of your arm, and that played well into the film. It was a neat perspective that I think spoke to a lot of people.
I read that you were a pianist before your accident. How did you grapple with your new reality and having to build a new career for yourself?
I started playing piano when I was three, started taking lessons when I was four, and studied piano for 18 years, all the way through college. I was a classical piano major. I played with symphonies and all that kind of stuff. And in just a matter of seconds... Well, I lost my left hand that day and then my right hand about a month later. So, piano playing was over. At the time, I was 30 years old, so I’d spent over half my life learning to play the piano, and it was instantly gone. And the piano was my psychologist. From the time I was a kid, if something bothered me, I would sit and play the piano. My mother could always tell something was wrong because I would play from one song to the next without stopping for an hour to an hour and a half. It took a while to acclimate to not having that release.
I was married to my first wife; we’d been married 11 years. I had a child that was six years old, and when I was in the hospital, my wife left. I always say she wanted a man with a slow hand, not a man with a stainless-steel touch. So when I got out of the hospital, not only was I starting a new role, I was doing it as a solo act. I learned early on that it was easiest for me if I adapted myself to the world rather than expecting the world to adapt to me. Like using a regular coffee cup—I have to hold it at the bottom of the hook, instead of at the top, because if I hold it at the top, it spills over. Just learning that one little thing, I can use any coffee cup, basically.
In recent years, Ali Stroker won a Tony for Oklahoma, CODA won three Oscars, and Daruma is getting positive reviews. Do you feel that we’re inching towards more authentic representation of disabled individuals in entertainment?
Inching is a good descriptor. I was cleaning up stuff on computers, and I found notes that I had made for a talk I gave over 30 years ago. When I looked at it, representation in film and television—and back then, we only had the three networks—was like 0.9%. That’s how many characters in network television were written with a disability. And the majority of them were done by able-bodied actors sitting in a wheelchair, or they would green screen their legs off.
I recently spoke at MGM Amazon. The number that I used is 2%. The USC Annenberg studied the top films and television shows. [The latest statistic] is right about 2%. There’s two ways to look at that: “Yay! We doubled the numbers in 35 years. This is so great!” Yet, when we look at the latest census report, 25% of the population, or about one in four people, have a disability, so we’ve got 25% of the population that doesn’t see themselves represented on the screen.
The disability community is small. I’ve known Ali since she was a young whippersnapper. I know Marlee [Matlin]. I know Troy [Kotsur]. It’s a very small community within Hollywood. When we see those [wins], they’re so celebrated. We go, “What a difference we’re making!” But when you actually look at the numbers, when you boil it down, it’s only 2% of the characters, and we still have able-bodied people playing people with disabilities. Disability goes across all other protected groups, whether it’s race, gender, LGBTQ status. It is not a private club. It’s one that we all will join at some point. I say when I give talks, “This isn’t an exclusive club. Drive careful going home.” [Laughs]
When you give these talks, do you feel as though the executives are receptive to change?
I think they’re receptive. I’ve always thought it was better to educate the gatekeepers about disability. There are trained actors with disabilities out there. And I understand that when you have this big blockbuster movie, you’ve got to have a name to draw in viewers, but they could still have a ton of guest stars. A good example is Peter Farrelly, who executive produced [Daruma]—he’s always supportive of disability. Peter shot a film in Australia called Ricky Stanicky. Even in Australia, Peter looked, searched, hunted, got casting directors to find people with disabilities [to perform] in his film. There were six or eight people with disabilities, and they weren’t just in the background. They had speaking roles. That’s important, that we see that and that they get that experience. Because how am I ever going to be an A-list actor, unless I’m given the chance and given the experience to get to that point?
So I’ve always been a big supporter of education, and I think they are receptive. But a lot of people want to make a donation to disability rather than an investment. You know, “We should be inclusive. We’ll have DEI.” But then when it comes to actually making an investment in disability, the old saying of putting your money where your mouth is, that’s a whole different situation.
I was just on set a couple of weeks ago, and they had all these ramps built to get equipment into the building, because there were steps. That would have worked for anybody in a wheelchair. They do that for the equipment, but they go, “Oh my God, we’d have to make so many accommodations for somebody in a wheelchair.” I remember years ago seeing this cartoon about a kid in a wheelchair. It’s snowing, and there’s a ramp and there’s three steps, and the custodian is shoveling snow off the steps. And he goes, “Don’t worry, when I finish this, I’ll get to you.” And the kid goes, “But if you do the ramp, we all can go in.”
Accommodations made for people with disabilities work for people that don’t have disabilities, like closed captions. There was a recent study done that [showed] 80% of the people that use closed captions are able-bodied, but they use it to understand the language or the accents. It’s what’s called the “curb cut effect.” Curb cuts were made for people in wheelchairs to not have to bounce up the curb at the corner of a crossing. But yet, those curb cuts work for delivery divers with two-wheelers. The curb cut effect helps everyone.
As a performer, who are some of your influences?
A couple of years after I lost my hands, I was watching an episode of China Beach with Dana Delany. Her grandfather was played by Harold Russell, who was in the 1946 film The Best Years of Our Lives. And he was an actual double amputee. He was holding the Styrofoam cup by the top. And I go, “That’s how I do it!” Because if I hold it by the sides, I’ll crush it. I didn’t know who he was. Never heard of him or anything. He was on an episode of Entertainment Tonight where they interviewed him, and he was talking about working on the film, working on China Beach, [working] as the president’s advisor for hiring the handicap, and he said he’s retired in Hyannis Port, Massachusetts. Back then you could look up the area code for Hyannis Port and dial the area code and get the local information. So I did that. I was talking to my [second] wife. I go, “That guy’s been in television and film. There’s a chance for me! I could do this!” I called information and she gave me Harold Russell’s number. I dialed the number, and I go, “Mr. Harold Russell?” He goes, “Yes.” I go, “The movie star?” And he just laughed. He was really nice, and he listened to my story—that I got hurt, I’ve been an actor and performer—and we became good friends over the years.
Harold is the only actor in the history of the Academy Awards who has won two Oscars for the same role. It’s about five men who come home from World War II with what we would call today PTSD, but Harold was a double amputee. The director saw him in a Navy training film where he was playing ping-pong, helping veterans recover, so he cast him in the film. The Academy did not think he would win. He was not really an actor, plus with him being a veteran and disabled, they thought he would never win a Best Supporting Actor against all the other movies that were up. So they gave him a special Oscar for helping the troops. They’d given him that Oscar ahead of time. And then when they announced the Best Supporting Actor Oscar he actually won, so he’s the only actor in history to ever win two Oscars for the same role. But, yeah, seeing Harold on screen was a big influence for me to think there could be life after this in the acting world.
Being a working actor is difficult. What advice would you give to those who have dreams of becoming a performer?
The daruma doll is about perseverance and one of the things that goes with it is fall down seven times, get up eight. That’s also a good mantra for acting, because you’re going to audition eight times and you might get seven nos, you might get eight nos, but the ninth one might be the yes that changes your life.
I think anybody who wants to get into the business, it’s just a matter of staying in the business. And it gets hard. Eight years ago, when we made the proof of concept [for Daruma], they shopped that around to all the studios, and they go, “Oh, that’s great. Let’s see, we can put this A-list actor in the wheelchair.” No, no, no—the line in the sand for the producer and director was it has to be authentically cast. And they go, “Oh, well, good luck with that.” They got turned away by everybody. And they said, “Let’s just do it ourselves.”
They scraped and did fundraising and put a bunch of money into it themselves. We had a lot of in-kind donations. The grandparents’ house [in the film] is actually my house. We used my house as a location. Patrick’s house is Toby’s house. There was a lady who donated meals to everybody on set for the run of the film. [The crew] worked for much less than what their rate was. They all got paid, but they slept on the floor, they slept on couches. That’s how dedicated everybody was to this project, because of the story. That’s hard to find these days. So I would give anyone the advice just to keep at it. You’re going to fall down seven times but get up eight.
To learn more about John W. Lawson, find him on Instagram.
To learn more about Daruma, visit the film’s website.
This interview has been edited for clarity and length.
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